What Sort of Savior…?

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What Sort of Savior…? | #salvation

Sin and Sinful Nature

What Sort of Savior…?

“Yes, He saved you, but from what - from Your own sins or from His own Father’s rules?“

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you're making some lovely points in this article, caleb.
i'm not too worried about the 'christian' viewpoint, i leave them to themselves, and i wasn't even aware of the existence of a 'calvarian' viewpoint defined as such, but i want to comment on some of that viewpoint, on what they sparked off in my mind.

i quote you
- the Divine Law doesn’t make something evil or good. It simply lets you know which is which -
if that didn't make me think of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil!
and that then made me think, hmm, looks like seeing as 'we' disobeyed that very first command not to eat of the fruit of it and were kicked out before we could also eat of the fruit of the tree of life and live forever, we were doomed to roam the earth until our deaths.
but then, the process to save us from this doom was put into motion, and we were given to eat more of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that is the Law given thru moses.

qouting you again
-The Instructions of our Heavenly Father were not set in place to regulate what is and is not wickedness. They were set in place to let us know what is and is not wickedness. -
now that's very much what paul meant when he talked about sin being exposed as sin in romans 7.
basically, so we can't say but we didn't know.

then you said Yeshua died, quoting you again
- to satisfy the required penalty for our perversions, to demonstrate proper obedience, and to strengthen standard for our better understanding forever after.
Torah had a built-in method of redemption where an innocent victim could suffer and be slaughtered for the sins of the people -
now Yeshua's demonstrated obedience satisfying the required penalty definitely was part of His subsequent resurrection to life forever.

and you correctly use the word demonstrate, because a demonstration has the intention for it to be emulated, once we understand better, to do what He says, 'follow Me'.
innocently suffer for the sins of your fellows,
'as we also have forgiven our debtors',
which we can only really do once we 'die to ourselves'.
for while we live to ourselves we either also fall into transgression against our debtors, not forgiving them, or, like adam and eve did, we try and evade our own responsibilities by shifting blame.
and while we live to ourselves we may follow the letter of the Law, but in our hearts?
this is the 'more' that Yeshua did, and told us to do, and what part of it is outside of the Law?
just be the innocent sacrifice the Law requires.
in this wonderful way our Father now lets us reach out our hand and take from the tree of life and eat.

it really is worthwhile pondering that in the new creation there are the bride, inhabitants of jerusalem, of israel, and of nations around.
which kinds of followers get to be part of what grouping..?

i'm eager to hear more 'calvarian' viewpoints, in fact, i'm going to google this concept now...

you're making some lovely points in this article, caleb. 
i'm not too worried about the 'christian' viewpoint, i leave them to themselves, and i wasn't even aware of the existence of a 'calvarian' viewpoint defined as such, but i want to comment on some of that viewpoint, on what they sparked off in my mind. 
 
i quote you 
- the Divine Law doesn’t make something evil or good. It simply lets you know which is which - 
if that didn't make me think of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil! 
and that then made me think, hmm, looks like seeing as 'we' disobeyed that very first command not to eat of the fruit of it and were kicked out before we could also eat of the fruit of the tree of life and live forever, we were doomed to roam the earth until our deaths. 
but then, the process to save us from this doom was put into motion, and we were given to eat more of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that is the Law given thru moses. 
 
qouting you again 
-The Instructions of our Heavenly Father were not set in place to regulate what is and is not wickedness. They were set in place to let us know what is and is not wickedness. - 
now that's very much what paul meant when he talked about sin being exposed as sin in romans 7. 
basically, so we can't say but we didn't know. 
 
then you said Yeshua died, quoting you again 
- to satisfy the required penalty for our perversions, to demonstrate proper obedience, and to strengthen standard for our better understanding forever after. 
Torah had a built-in method of redemption where an innocent victim could suffer and be slaughtered for the sins of the people - 
now Yeshua's demonstrated obedience satisfying the required penalty definitely was part of His subsequent resurrection to life forever. 
 
and you correctly use the word demonstrate, because a demonstration has the intention for it to be emulated, once we understand better, to do what He says, 'follow Me'. 
innocently suffer for the sins of your fellows,  
'as we also have forgiven our debtors',  
which we can only really do once we 'die to ourselves'. 
for while we live to ourselves we either also fall into transgression against our debtors, not forgiving them, or, like adam and eve did, we try and evade our own responsibilities by shifting blame. 
and while we live to ourselves we may follow the letter of the Law, but in our hearts? 
this is the 'more' that Yeshua did, and told us to do, and what part of it is outside of the Law? 
just be the innocent sacrifice the Law requires. 
in this wonderful way our Father now lets us reach out our hand and take from the tree of life and eat. 
 
it really is worthwhile pondering that in the new creation there are the bride, inhabitants of jerusalem, of israel, and of nations around. 
which kinds of followers get to be part of what grouping..? 
 
i'm eager to hear more 'calvarian' viewpoints, in fact, i'm going to google this concept now...

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